I recommend using a solid rocket booster (or 2 or 5) to you get you the altitude and then launch a small rocket powered plane. I checked the wiki before I wrote my question, it seems I overread this paragraph Something that I think has become less clear since someone updated the wiki. Basically I can hit a target altitude of 20,000m but can not maintain it. If it's below the cross-hairs, you need a little more AoA. (Actually, four ways: but balloons aren't in the stock game) Lifting surfaces are great but they lose effectiveness just as fast with altitude as drag falls. I also added a parachute and decoupler since I find it too hard to correctly land this thing yet ;-) I managed to land in the water once, though. At altitude the nose goes up and down until it goes out of control. Secondly don't think of engines working better at different altitudes, think of them working better with different air intake quantities. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Either of the two speeds are to be avoided. Don't worry about Isp. I've added more engines, more intakes to no avail. Air Intake: Air Intake shows the amount of force your engine uses to suck air into the turbine. KSP doesn't care (much) about aspect ratio; the total lift is the same regardless of configuration. Note that KSP planes get one substantial speed benefit that's much more pronounced than IRL aircraft, due to the freakishly small planet sizes: they're actually flying at a large fraction of orbital velocity. These are the building blocks of solid spaceplane design!Subscribe! Air temperatures vary with latitude and time of day. Which lets you go faster, which lets you climb higher. If it's above the cross-hairs, you need a little less. Here's my example of dealing with the situation. Which is capable of high altitude, high speed flight. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Or try using SRBs instead. Clear editor. This lowers their effective "weight"-- for example, a craft flying at 1400 m/s on Kerbin is effectively flying as if gravity were only 2/3 of its actual value. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one. It may work with stock too, I just don't know. Remembering the FW TA152 and the U2 I put long wings on it and while its turn rate makes an airliner look like a fighter plane it is stable enough at 19000m. To get higher with the low tech jet engines, you need rocket assist. 3x06: I design a new, high altitude, jet to collect high. its rather flat but its a solid surface. air) that high up. Your link has been automatically embedded. Typically, I watch my Apoapsis as I boost to the high altitude, and there's enough momentum to coast to the peak before completely running out of fuel. So I'm pretty darn new to KSP, and my career has barely gotten started, and the jobs for crew observations seem to dominate I'm going to try adding a small solid fuel rocket engine toned down to get the initial height then dump it, as well as check into that high end gear mentioned. You may be correct and that 3 engine plane is a lemon. ksp high altitude plane. In KSP2, you are a rocket scientist who must build and test rockets, spaceships, and planes. I don't have the numbers handy, but you can expect something like 400m/s at 15km. It will be expensive and time consuming. Keep in mind that wheesley engine's performance decreases significantly as the altitude increases. Using very light "engine rich" planes and "reverse swooping" (building velocity at 10km then gently curving up) you can temporarily get above 20km with Wheesely and Juno. The X-37 is operated by the United States Space Force for orbital spaceflight missions intended to demonstrate reusable space technologies. So the faster you go the higher you can fly where there is less drag. A well-designed jet with this engine and with the afterburner lit, flown properly, can momentarily climb to 30,000 m altitude. Imagine that first plane but with the bubble cockpit and the old style round intakes. Grichman's answer got me in the right direction. At about 400-500m/s (~15km), the two engines are even. Range with this method is pretty short due to drag. Will post my results. That's because wings need to have some AoA to the airstream in order to generate much lift. The high performance engine for me performs pretty good till about 15000 meter. This can be done with moar boosters or more calculated wing and body design, depending on the aero model you use. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. So Pvt. lost birth certificate near berlin; ksp high altitude plane. You get tons of thrust if you put it into "wet" mode, but you lose fuel efficiency. Originally posted by lord bird: yep thats right jool has a surface. Dedicated to the growth and advancement of amateur rocket scientists! So if you want to make a plane go as fast as possible, you want to minimise both angle of attack and angle of incidence necessary to sustain level flight at your target speed and altitude. Because of the exponential nature of the rocket equationthe orbital rocket needs to be considerably bigger. Knowing how to design these types of planes make jumping in to SSTO design very easy as there are only a few minor changes that need to be made.Music Credits:1st Song: \"Elephants\" - YouTube Audio Library2nd Song: \"Hot Heat\" - YouTube Audio Library3rd Song: \"Echoes\" - Kasbo - https://soundcloud.com/k-sboWhat game is this? That will probably allow you to fly comfortably above 20-25km (or higher, depending on the overall mass of your aircraft). This works, but it's not optimal. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers.. Visit Stack Exchange Contents 1 Usage 2 Construction 3 Categories 3.1 Airplane 3.2 Seaplane 3.3 Spaceplane 3.4 VTOL 3.5 Glider 3.6 Mothership 4 Operation 4.1 Flight records 5 Notes Usage Don't be too surprised if KSP's aero model breaks down in edge cases. At the equator, sea level temperatures vary between a nighttime low of 9 C and a daytime high of 15 C. Also, Valley and Theomon fly to different corners of Kerbin and three mapping satellites are launched. Subscribe - http://www.youtube.com/c/MikeAben?sub-confirmation=1 Patreon - https://www.patreon.com/MikeAbenPatreon supporters receive early, ad-free, access to videos, kOS and craft files, and more. Discord - https://discord.gg/HTvT7dZ Making Space Home Playlist - https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLB3Ia8aQsDKhqoFyoZ4d33MG7rS9KmDm_0:00 - Designing the Dudley Mk16:42 - Test Flights \u0026 Iterating13:45 - Col. Valley take the Seaplane to the Northern Ice Shelf19:30 - Launch \u0026 Insertion of the Maxwell Vb21:04 - Col. Theomon \u0026 Orlin Visit the Badlands in the Panther24:20 - Launch \u0026 Ejection of the Maxwell VI26:34 - Designing the SENTINEL 129:47 - Launch \u0026 Insertion of the Maxwell VIIFull List of Mods: Aviation Lights Chatterer Community Tech Tree Crew R\u0026R Croud Sourced Science Contract Configurator Contract Packs: Bases and Stations Reborn CommNet Relays Exploration Plus Field Research Kerbal Academy Tourism Plus Contracts Window+ Decoupler Shroud Easy Vessel Switch Kerbal Alarm Clock Kerbal Attachment System Kerbal Construction Time Kerbal Engineer Redux Kerbal Inventory System Kerbalism kOS KRASH Maneuver Node Evolved Navball Alignment Indicator Near Future Aeronautics Near Future Construction Near Future Electrical Near Future Propulsion Near Future Solar Near Future Spacecraft Persistent Rotation Rational Resources RCS Build Aid Continued Restock Restock+ SCANsat Scrapyard SMART Parts Stage Recovery Stockalike Station Parts Expansion Redux TAC Fuel Balancer Texture Replacer Trajectories Transfer Window Planner Universal Storage 2 Unkerballed Start Waypoint Manager If too much air runs into the turbine, the excessive amount just flows out unused through side-vents (I think). That's just a guess, though-- perhaps someone more familiar with FAR could weigh in.). The Kerbal Space Program subreddit. What am I doing wrong here in the PlotLegends specification. Basically there are two things that limit your maximum speed: thrust and speed of sound and with that your maximum altitude. Not only does it conk out at high altitudes, but also it conks out at high speeds, and you need to be able to go fast to fly up high. I start with the normal jet engines (which takes almost the complete runway). Paste as plain text instead, Thanks. Very cool. Which makes this engine ideal for those missions which require doing many science activities above particular altitudes. Make sure you've angled your wings up slightly so that you provide enough lift for a 0 angle of attack at top speed. Unfortunately I won't be able to test it today, but @SaintWacko's proposal sounds promising. Paste as plain text instead, I'm in career mode (have the turbofan engine) and trying to get some science readings for a mission at a high altitude. These designs are great for getting around Kerbin quickly, but without going orbital. high-1 A Screenshot of Kerbal Space Program By: miklkit This is the current version. Proceed with caution. I don't recall if they model aspect ratio, but either way, the struts are murder and the delta wing has so much more wing that it'll still have more lift. When you are surrounded by plenty of air there will of course be no need to suck in air artificially but the higher you get the less dense the air around you becomes and in order to make sure that your engines have enough oxygen to burn the fuel it needs to suck air in forcefully. The most obvious solution is try and optimize your craft for high altitude lift by giving it long wingspan like a U-2 spyplane. In the stock atmosphere, the benefits of moving faster outweigh almost everything else. Upload or insert images from URL. The Boeing X-37, also known as the Orbital Test Vehicle (OTV), is a reusable robotic spacecraft. If too little air runs into the turbine your combustion chamber will not be able to burn up fuel effectively due to the lack of oxygen. Or about the same speed but 1000 m higher. The returns are diminishing so eventually you will hit a ceiling. Been a while since I've flown stock*, but I've heard that, for maximum efficiency, you want one turbojet for every 7.5 tons, and about four ram intakes for each turbojet. FBW uses three controllers - pitch, roll and yaw. Trying to do something without the right part is long and difficult path. Clear editor. This can make it a good alternative for when you want something that can be controllable and doesn't need excessive heat shielding, but still need to be able to go incredibly fast if necessary, at the expense of increased fuel consumption. I'd almost expect it to work better in stock since infini-gliders can be done. I was even able to do this with three pairs of Junos instead of the large jet engine pair (I don't have the technology level for that). 1Altitude requirement 2Orbit 3Speed, range, and altitude 4Flight duration 5Flight profiles 5.1Ballistic missiles 5.2Tourist flights 5.3Scientific experiments 5.4Sub-orbital transportation 6Notable uncrewed sub-orbital spaceflights 7Crewed sub-orbital spaceflights 8Future of crewed sub-orbital spaceflight 9See also 10References Third, which I haven't given a good try, would be a carefully-timed deorbit maneuver so you come down through your desired location as you fall from space. If you nudge your wing's angle up slightly with rotate tool then it'll move your prograde closer to your direction of flight and significantly reduce drag. surface of jool. Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? Or it can supercruise at three times the speed of an equivalent Wheesley jet (with nearly equal fuel efficiency) at 15,000 m altitude. Thankyou all, I now reckon I have a much better understanding of the engines, hopefully that'll translate to better aircraft. A well-designed jet with this engine and with the afterburner lit, flown properly, can momentarily climb to 30,000 m altitude. It flames out at 25,000. Simply changing the intakes made it fly completely out of control and impossible to land. It only takes a minute to sign up. Why is there a voltage on my HDMI and coaxial cables? The most efficient way is, of course, to make a high altitude (or space) plane. Check out the website and try the game out for yourself :Dhttps://kerbalspaceprogram.com/ Or you need to put a little bit of angle of incidence in your wings, which will reduce drag since you don't have to pitch the entire plane up, but will be stuck at a fixed angle meaning you'll have to pitch up or down anyway during certain phases of the flight that the plane isn't optimised for. Also, jets eat fuel at pounds-per-minute -- if you cover twice as much ground in the same time, your plane will be more efficient. If the wings are flat and your plane steadily loses altitude in level flight at a given speed (as most designs will by default), it means you either need to pitch up slightly, increasing the angle of attack and keeping your vertical velocity at 0 by flying up slightly to compensate for the pull of gravity that lift isn't compensating for. rev2023.3.3.43278. I did some testing and found that the turbojets get the best Isp around 5.2 km altitude, so I was thinking of flying at that altitude. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one. Once you're at that regime, you should be able to cover huge distances on tiny amounts of fuel. Note that KSP planes get one substantial speed benefit that's much more pronounced than IRL aircraft, due to the freakishly small planet sizes: they're actually flying at a large fraction of orbital velocity. Because when your engine has to take in air forcefully it automatically means there isn't enough surrounding your engine and that again means that air density and therefor air resistance must be pretty low too. What altitude and speed should I go? To get there, you're going to want to climb at the fastest rate you can manage to 18-20 km, at which point you should mostly level off and start accelerating horizontally. The drag differential is because your long-wing layout is using a bunch of struts, and the reason your delta-wing has a higher ceiling is because it has more wing area to provide lift. Thanks for the help! Cookie Notice How can I make money in the new career mode? There are two factors to that: how thick the air is, how fast the ship is going. I would like to know which altitude I have to maintain for my experiments. Only the fuel tanks attached to rockets have any oxidiser in them. Yes. Your airspeed is mostly limited by terminal velocity; you can go much faster if you climb a little higher. The Panther engine can hold 19,000 steady and oscillates around 20,000. Slap that behind a plane you'll be able to go beyond 20km without any trouble. Ep. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one. Aircraft can be very temperamental to fly, especially on the keyboard. I currently have a contract where I'm asked to take crew reports at certain spots on Kerbal at an altitude of 18,000m. Any of my search term words; All of my search term words; Find results in. with a thrust vectoring range of only 3 degrees. All other versions are slower and lower and unstable in turns. Under some circumstances, you may want to reduce the engine gimbal range or disable it altogether, particularly when flying at high speeds (e.g. Air Flow + max. Main goals: Auto-trimming. Along with rockets, planes are one of KSP's most commonly referenced kinds of vessel, and are a vessel type . Alternatively, you can assign the afterburner toggle (labelled "switch mode") to an action group if you wish to activate it with a hotkey. Even better, burn a little more, and you can pop out of the atmosphere for a bit and avoid all that nasty drag stuff. You can post now and register later. If you've attached them to your fuselage with zero AoA, what that means is that when you fly, you're going to have to have the entire plane pitched slightly above in order to generate lift. Do plugins for Kerbal Space Program work on unix? Press J to jump to the feed. The easiest "default" way to build a plane in KSP-- i.e. Technically, any rocket engine is also a jet engine as it forms a high-speed jet of reaction mass. Its an approximation missing someelements. The most efficient way is, of course, to make a high altitude (or space) plane. at the very least, you'd need the panther, that'll get you over 16k easily, well to 25k. You can post now and register later. A temple in the desert (6 29 47 S 141 40 3 W) known as Tut-Un Jeb-Ahn, although this name can only be seen when a vessel crashes into it. The ideal case for optimally efficient flight (which is what you want if you're trying to maximize cruise altitude) is when your wings are mounted to the body, pitched up just enough that when cruising in level flight, the body of the aircraft is pointing perfectly . Anyway thanks in advance. If you want to cover your aircraft with loads of intakes, I'm sure you could easily fly above 35km and reach 2000+ m/s velocity. Is anywhere a list of the altitude levels (I don't know a better term) available? Upload or insert images from URL. But a rockets can do it. jet engine efficiency in this game is based on built in thrust curves. Remember that you need to have intakes somewhere in line with the engine to function at that altitude. I also had problems with a high altitude plane until I decided to follow the K.I.S.S. Turbojets are so ridiculously efficient that it doesn't really matter. Things that work at low altitude don't work so well up high and the plane ends up going up and down while slowly losing speed until it can't maintain altitude anymore. Are you using Stock or NEAR/FAR? Your link has been automatically embedded. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Why do many companies reject expired SSL certificates as bugs in bug bounties? How to make a loop for linear actuator in Kerbal Space Program, Breaking Ground. So, to correct " is below crosshairs", what you need to do is to add a little AoA to the wings. So if you replace the turbos with basic jets, you will have more thrust from the ground up, and your vessel will weigh slightly less. Basically you just need to fiddle with it and try some test flights. Listen to this guy, don't go much farther above 15000 with high altitude engines. That annoys me but I can't seem to get a design to make it work. EDIT: Essentially, make like an SR-71, if an SR-71 didn't have cooling problems limiting it to Mach 3.4. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. 2/3 (KSP 1.11.2) - YouTube I break out the Mk2 parts and Panther engines to build a better jet that can go higher and faster. Subscribe -. You'll notice that usually your prograde marker is slightly below your pitch. Immediately starting rocket engines at full throttle turned out to make most of my aircrafts totally unstable, turning them up gradually worked way better. 3x06: I design a new, high altitude, jet to collect high atmospheric science. Evidence. edited 6 yr. ago. Unfortunately, there's no simple rule to tell you what the angle needs to be when you're building the plane-- it depends on lots of variables, such as your weight, drag, intended cruising altitude, intended cruising speed. even stranger is that the surface is textured. Yes, you can get into that range with the high end stuff (whiplash engines and ram or shock cone air intakes). By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. The flight time won't be as long, but you'll be able to fly a "plane" above 18km. First off as of .15.1 intakes don't do anything. I tried building a plane but can't climb higher than about 11,000m (I don't have many plane parts yet, though). Put a couple of radial mount parachutes just above the com and add a reaction wheel. It seems to be based on the General Electric F-404 Afterburning Turbofan, which shares the same name and maximum thrust (85 kN dry). - "In Space Low" means your craft is inside the "Space Border" altitude and in an orbital path. Hopefully this will be helpful to you. Approximately 12km up the main engines stop providing enough thrust to maintain the climb, so it's time to switch to rocket mode. - but they were talking about having two intakes/engine. Well, this game isn't a perfect flight simulator yet, so it will be difficult to figure out. If it's below the cross-hairs, you need a little more AoA. But my guess is that these same general principles would probably apply to FAR, and that all that would change would be the numbers involved. Thank you, I was able to reach up to 24km altitude with this design. Minimising the environmental effects of my dyson brain, Theoretically Correct vs Practical Notation. The SR-71 could probably fly higher, but it isn't flying any more. I didn't succeed with his design, though; I always ended up having somehow unstable airplanes. It is somewhat slow but very steady in flight. Chapter 4. Thanks, I'll go try to stuff a few extra turbojets and intakes on my plane Do you know how many intakes/turbojet are needed to run in the regime you described? Building a High Altitude Jet | Stream pt. At this point the plane plummets, but as it goes deeper into the atmosphere, it regains pitch authority, and at 10km it's enough to regain control and turn it around for a safe landing. Yes, although they have only been flown with nearly full tanks. Another approach, which I was managing with some success before I figured out jets, is to build a rocket and catapult yourself towards the measurement point. If you upgrade to the panther (or get one on a contract) that engine can get you much higher. This thread is quite old. If that's all a case of Too Many Words, think of it this way: Suppose you just build a plane the "default" way and don't put any. Should i add a larger wing area for higher lift? If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. Using indicator constraint with two variables, Is there a solution to add special characters from software and how to do it. Use the reaction wheel to hold your attitude slightly nose down as you float down and you can guide yourself like a paraglider. - Insane TWR didn't help. In the game, players direct a nascent space program, staffed and crewed by green humanoid aliens known as "Kerbals". Highest and fastest possible is best. When I say ", You know you've nailed it correctly if, when you're in level flight, your. Air Flow: Air Flow represents with how much force air passes the turbine (notice: different amounts of air at the same speed equals in different amounts of force!). Pasted as rich text. Note that you need to activate the afterburner ("Wet Mode") manually. ksp high altitude planebad bunny tour 2022 tickets ksp high altitude plane. All the information you could want to know about science, including the altitudes for each celestial body, and what altitudes a given experiment works on are available at: http://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/Science. My question is really about controllability. It is usually best for initial designs to be based on logic and real-world physics and then be prepared to experiment with non-logical alternatives for optimisation. This is the first version. - Spamming airintakes didn't help. Display as a link instead, If drag were the only concern, at any given altitude the slower you go, the less fuel you need: the work done by drag over a distance grows linearly with speed (the force grows quadratically with speed, but the time falls linearly). Ok, the panther engine is still not good enough. Incidentally, for these speeds and altitudes, ordinary jets are the better choice. Delta-V is the velocity change necessary to perform orbital maneuvers. Build a plane or rocket for Kerbal high altitudes, We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup, Screenshot of the Week #85 [Submissions Closed - Vote Now!]. What are the units of measure used in Kerbal Space Program? High altitude flight is efficient because the air is thinner, and therefore aircraft experience less parasitic drag. Display as a link instead, This way control surface max deflection can be programmed by an aircraft designer to make . This is particularly useful for pairs of engines, since this makes it possible to keep the thrust equal when activating the afterburners. They will someday, but they don't now. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Cheers again fellas. Powered by Invision Community. With only panthers unlocked I might add. My 'plane science' is more advanced than my 'rocket science' (career mode) because I got tired of seeing all the high-altitude missions I had on the books and wanted to finish them. What are the minimum altitudes for each warp level? With some fins to keep you stable and careful aim, you can hit your desired location and altitude and will have 5-10 seconds to collect data before you hurtle past it and pull your chute. I've since shaved that down more but that was by going even higher and even faster). One problem is i'm running stock on career mode and only have 30 part to spare, so large planes are out of the question. June 3, 2022 . This is my current best hi alt plane. The maximum cruise altitude is just over 40,000 feet. Then I increase throttle until about 2/3 or even full, climbing with a high inclination (it can also go straight up). Orbiting is the most fun one: the higher the orbit, the less speed you need to maintain to stay in orbit, *and* the less air there is, so that's a double-whammy in terms of reducing fuel consumption. However, it seems as if your delta wing has has more area, might that be it? Your answer got me in the right direction, though I ended up with a different design (see my own answer). 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. The U-2's published maximum altitude is somewhere above 74,000 feet. Your link has been automatically embedded. To reach the initial low Earth orbit of the International Space Stationof 300 km (now 400 km), the delta-v is over six times higher, about 9.4 km/s. - Inside the atmosphere works the same way, except you need to be on an suborbital trajectory. For more information, please see our That's all true, but just read the OP: hypersonic appears to be completely out of the question. Isn't that backwards snark? 1 1: The basics 2 2: Setting it up 3 3: First flight 4 4: Finishing touches 1: The basics First of all, you're going to need an airplane. I am currently designing a mission that will involve several very long distance plane flights. The benefits should be obvious. - Insane lift to weight didn't help. Rationale: If that's all a case of Too Many Words, think of it this way: Suppose you just build a plane the "default" way and don't put any AoA at all on the wings. You cannot paste images directly. EDIT: Didn't notice you were using FAR. If your using NEAR/FAR, once you get high and fast, kill the engine and glide to save fuel. Or is it the same for all celestial bodies? Why that? Thats my problem right now. It has two modes: The first, Dry mode, is similar to that of the J-33 "Wheesley" Basic Jet Engine, with a bit more thrust. Download (104.45 MiB) License: CC BY-NC-SA 4.0 Game Version: 1.8.1 Downloads: 371,115 Author: blackheart612 Mod Website: Forum Thread Support this mod: Donate Followers: 626 Outdated Mod This mod is not known to work with the latest version of Kerbal Space Program. Once it's in the air, it's stable and easy to fly and manages to fly at altitudes between 11k 12k without problems. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Information Changelog Stats To avoid running out of fuel altogether, I have a second plane with small tanks (no oxidizer) attached directly to the jet engines, and the rockets attached behind the fuselage, which is entirely oxidized tanks.
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